They say you shouldn’t watch tv or do any electronic stuff on an I pad etc late at night as there is too much stimulation going on.  Reading apparently better.

Although you say you don’t want to go down the sleeping pill route, could you take them just for say 3 days to get you back to a more regular routine?

From personal experience, the worst thing to do is to try to get to sleep.  Does your schedule allow you to sleep on in the mornings?  If so, when you’re awake in the middle of the night, could you say to yourself that it doesn’t really matter as you can sleep on later?

If you’re not sleeping because you’re worried you could have a piece of paper by your bed to write them down and then say to yourself you’ll consider them in the morning?

Also don’t make your bedroom anything else but where you sleep eg don’t work in there as well.

I’ve heard that a short nap during the day eg 20 mins is ok , you just don’t want to make it too long.

Hope that helps -now I’ve got to practice what I preach!

Hi hopecalm

Thank you for repling to my post with your helpful insights. Ill try switching from watching TV to reading before bed. I do have anxiety with the cancer mostly about getting my affairs in order finance for family funeral arrangements and so on. The tip on writing a note to consider in the morning is novel and something I shall do. I get excercise each day as I force myself to do a few hours work  which keeps me sane. I also go for walk 20 mins to one hour depending on fatigue level. Bedroom is dark and quiet as recommended. Daytime naps are dangerous as they end up being 2 hours rather than 20 mins and Ill hold off on the sleeping potions for now anyway. All the best.

Ed

Hi Ed

This is a late reply so apologies, I have been exactly the same as you. Tried all sorts of wonderful things to keep me asleep as I had no problem falling asleep just had the 3am curse! Finally after a lot of 3am wakeups I spoke to my oncologist and now take zopiclone 3.75 mg x2 each evening.

I don't have a set time I have them when I get in bed, best thing ever for me I sleep minimal 7 hours, which is needed as we heal when we sleep, I'm not drowsy when I wake up neither

Hope this helps Ed, sleep is important, hope you're coping with your treatment it's not easy both physically and mentally

Hi Kallie

Thank you for your reply. Although using drugs to sleep is a last resort for me Im so desperate for a whole night of unbroken sleep that I may discuss this at my next appointment with the oncologist. I realise this is a short term fix but it may reset my sleep pattern giving me the energy to deal with the everyday challenges that living with cancer brings.

Ed

Hi Ed

I agree with you it was my last go to aswell, but on the grand scale of things, I thought to myself I'm fighting every day with this cancer I just need to sleep! So for me it's easier to cope with each day if I've had some sleep if that makes sense. I've had the all clear once but it's now back, I'm incurable but it can be controlled so I'm told.

I'm positive I always have been, so I take each day as it comes, we're all fighters here  I hope you eventually get some sleep Ed you need it. 

Take care

Kallie.

Hi Ed

I agree with you it was my last go to aswell, but on the grand scale of things, I thought to myself I'm fighting every day with this cancer I just need to sleep! So for me it's easier to cope with each day if I've had some sleep if that makes sense. I've had the all clear once but it's now back, I'm incurable but it can be controlled so I'm told.

I'm positive I always have been, so I take each day as it comes, we're all fighters here  I hope you eventually get some sleep Ed you need it. 

Take care

Kallie.

Hi Ed and Kallie,  I sometimes take half a zopliclone when I need to sleep as well.  The doctor will only give me fourteen tablets.  If I want to have anymore I have to have a consultation with the doctor which I find ludicrous.  They tell me they are addictive and not good and will stop working.  Like you both I have incurable cancer and have been prescribed tramadol and since then morphine and liquid morphine.  I asked the oncologist will I become a drug addict and he said so what.  I get his point because its a good quality of life we need.  So for the doctor to act so patronizing  makes me mad.  The zopliclone helps but I only take it now and then, especially waiting for scan results etc.  I wish you both sweet dreams and hopefully a good nights sleep..

Lee x

Thank you for sharing that with me Kallie. Im on palliative care with immunotherapy so treatable but incurable. I hate that word terminal. As Im already having medicines I guess another to help with sleep wont be such a big deal. Especially if your experience of not waking up groggy is also true for me. I hope youve had a good day today.

Ed

Hello Lee

Nice to hear from you again and I hope you too have had a good day. I like the idea of just using the zoplicone at minimal dose and only when needed. You have a good point that for those of us who have incurable cancer, addiction is probably the least of our problems. And to have access to medicine that gives up a better quality of pain free life is more important. Ive got a new mattress and pillows to see if that makes a difference to sleep quality. As Im not able to get comfortable due to back pain from metastatic bone cancer. Feels like I cracked a rib during a recent coughing fit. Had second round of denosumab with my regular immunotherapy. Seem to be tolerating it quite well. Going to drive down to the coast for a walk ( in the rain) then get fish and chips and sit and eat them while watching the waves roll in and fighting off the gulls. Ah!the simple pleasures in life.

Ed

Hiya Ed same here palliative with immunotherapy, had the first immunotherapy last week, I was on chemo but it was stopped at the dreaded 3 monthly scan it wasn't working and the cancer had doubled, it's in 3 lympnodes in my groin and one on my pelvic wall, happy days eh! I have no pain at the minute, which is a blessing, I've been fighting this since 2022 I had chemoradiotherapy early 2023 that didn't work neither, what is going on I ask myself. The end of 2023 I had major surgery. They removed the tumour, I have a colostomy, and life was good for a while then it returned November 2024 and this is where I'm at now, apologies a bit of a long tale, your day sounds great Ed, very therapeutic listening to the ocean. Take care  

Hiya Lee 

Hope your day has been OK, I originally got zopiclone from the oncologist after struggling to keep asleep, the thing was I was waking at 3am and couldn't go back to sleep, getting up at 7am and not even tired, it was barmy! Anyway things have evened out now, they are addictive but necessary I think for what we are going through, I'm waiting for a scan result will get it next week.

I think we're all the same regarding scans, I used to think it was just me.

Sorry to hear you're in pain I hope the morphine is helping you to cope. 

I hate cancer!

Take care Lee 

Just a quick one you're not terminal Ed please don't think that. Unless someone has told you are. New treatments are being found all the time, mu immunotherapy is for 2 years I've no idea if it will be successful I've had a lot of chemo and none has worked on my cancer so I'm hoping immunotherapy is different. Keep positive Ed and looking at the ocean. Apologies if I sound bossy but we all have to be positive to fight this flippin cancer. Take care

Hi Ed,

I'm sorry to hear that you are having bother with insomnia. I don't know whether or not you have tried the method used by the United States Navy Pre-Flight School? I cannot trace the original email, but the references are at the end of this article. I hope that this helps.

Kind regards,

Jolamine xx

Sorry Ed,

I omitted to post the article on insomnia - here it is.

Regards,

Jolamine  

The fastest way to sleep?

Spending more time trying to fall asleep rather than actually sleeping? You’re not alone.

Just the act of trying too hard can cause (or continue) a cycle of anxious, nerve-wracking energy that keeps our minds awake.

And if your mind can’t sleep, it’s really difficult for your body to follow. But there are scientific tricks you can try to flip the switch and guide your body into a safe shutdown mode.

We cover some science-based tricks to help you fall asleep faster.

How to sleep in 10 seconds

It usually takes a magic spell to fall asleep this quickly and on cue, but just like spells, with practice you can eventually get to the sweet 10-second spot.

Note: The method below takes a full 120 seconds to finish, but the last 10 seconds is said to be truly all it takes to finally snooze.

The military method

The popular military method, which was first reported by Sharon Ackerman, comes from a book titled “Relax and Win: Championship Performance.”

According to Ackerman, the United States Navy Pre-Flight School created a routine to help pilots fall asleep in 2 minutes or less. It took pilots about 6 weeks of practice, but it worked — even after drinking coffee and with gunfire noises in the background.

This practice is said to even work for people who need to sleep sitting up!

The military method

1. Relax your entire face, including the muscles inside your mouth.
2. Drop your shoulders to release the tension and let your hands drop to the side of your body.
3. Exhale, relaxing your chest.
4. Relax your legs, thighs, and calves.
5. Clear your mind for 10 seconds by imagining a relaxing scene.
6. If this doesn’t work, try saying the words “don’t think” over and over for 10 seconds.
7. Within 10 seconds, you should fall asleep!

If this doesn’t work for you, you may need to work on the foundations of the military method: breathing and muscle relaxation, which have some scientific evidence that they work. Also, some conditions such as ADHD or anxiety may interfere with this method’s effectiveness.

Keep reading to learn about the techniques this military method is based on and how to practice them effectively.

How to sleep in 60 seconds

These two methods, which focus on your breathe or muscles, help you take your mind off topic and back to bed.

If you’re a beginner trying these hacks out, these methods may take up to 2 minutes to work.

4-7-8 breathing method

Mixing together the powers of meditation and visualization, this breathing method becomes more effective with practice. If you have a respiratory condition, such as asthma or COPD, consider checking with your doctor before beginning, as this could aggravate your symptoms.

To prepare, place the tip of your tongue against the roof of your mouth, behind your two front teeth. Keep your tongue there the whole time and purse your lips if you need to.

How to do one cycle of 4-7-8 breathing:

1. Let your lips part slightly and make a whooshing sound as you exhale through your mouth.
2. Then close your lips and inhale silently through your nose. Count to 4 in your head.
3. Then hold your breath for 7 seconds.
4. After, exhale (with a whoosh sound) for 8 seconds.
5. Avoid being too alert at the end of each cycle. Try to practice it mindlessly.
6. Complete this cycle for four full breaths. Let your body sleep if you feel relaxation coming on earlier than anticipated.

Progressive muscle relaxation (PMR)

Progressive muscle relaxation, also known as deep muscle relaxation, helps you unwind.

The premise is to tense — but not strain — your muscles and relax to release the tension. This movement promotes tranquillity throughout your body. It’s a trick recommended to help with insomnia.

Before you start, try practicing the 4-7-8 method while imagining the tension leaving your body as you exhale.

Relaxation script

1. Raise your eyebrows as high as possible for 5 seconds. This will tighten your forehead muscles.
2. Relax your muscles immediately and feel the tension drop. Wait 10 seconds.
3. Smile widely to create tension in your cheeks. Hold for 5 seconds. Relax.
4. Pause 10 seconds.
5. Squint with your eyes shut. Hold 5 seconds. Relax.
6. Pause 10 seconds.
7. Tilt your head slightly back so you’re comfortably looking at the ceiling. Hold 5 seconds. Relax as your neck sinks back into the pillow.
8. Pause 10 seconds.
9. Keep moving down the rest of the body, from your triceps to chest, thighs to feet.
10. Let yourself fall asleep, even if you don’t finish tensing and relaxing the rest of your body.

As you do this, focus on how relaxed and heavy your body feels when it’s relaxed and in a comfortable state.

How to fall asleep in 120 seconds

If the previous methods still didn’t work, there might be an underlying blockage you need to get out. Try these techniques!

Tell yourself to stay awake

Also called paradoxical intention, telling yourself to stay awake may be a good way to fall asleep faster.

For people — especially those with insomnia — trying to sleep can increase performance anxiety.

Research has found that people who practiced paradoxical intention fell asleep faster than those who didn’t. If you often find yourself stressed out about trying to sleep, this method may be more effective than traditional, intentional breathing practices.

Visualize a calm place

If counting activates your mind too much, try engaging your imagination.

Some say that visualizing something can make it real, and it’s possible this works with sleep, too.

In a 2002 study from the University of Oxford, researchers found that people who engaged in “imagery distraction” fell asleep faster than those who had general distraction or no instructions.

Image distraction

1. Instead of counting sheep, try to imagine a serene setting and all the feelings that go with it. For example, you can imagine a waterfall, the sounds of echoing, rushing water, and the scent of damp moss. The key is to let this image take up space in your brain to prevent yourself from “re-engaging with thoughts, worries, and concerns” pre-sleep.

Acupressure for sleep

There’s not enough research to confidently determine if acupressure truly works. However, the research that’s available is promising.

One method is to target areas you know and feel are particularly tense, such as the upper part of your nose bridge or your temples.

However, there are also specific points in acupressure that are reported to help with insomnia. Here are three you can do without sitting up:

1. Spirit gate

The technique

1. Feel for the small, hollow space under your palm on your pinky side.
2. Gently apply pressure in a circular or up-and-down movement for 2 to 3 minutes.
3. Press down the left side of the point (palm facing) with gentle pressure for a few seconds, and then hold the right side (back-of-hand facing).
4. Repeat on the same area of your other wrist.

2. Inner frontier gate

The technique

1. On one palm facing up, count three finger-widths down from your wrist crease.
2. With your thumb, apply a steady downward pressure between the two tendons.
3. You can massage in circular or up-and-down motion until you feel your muscles relax.

3. Wind pool

The technique

1. Interlock your fingers together (fingers out and palms touching) and open up your palms to create a cup shape with your hands.
2. Position your thumbs at the base of your skull, with thumbs touching where your neck and head connect.
3. Apply a deep and firm pressure, using circular or up-and-down movements to massage this area.
4. Breathe deeply and pay attention to how your body relaxes as you exhale.

Prepare yourself fully before tackling these techniques

If you’ve tried these methods and are still finding yourself unable to fall asleep in 2 minutes or less, see if there are other tips you can take to make your bedroom a more sleep-friendly place.

Have you tried…

1. hiding your clock
2. taking a warm shower before bed
3. opening the window to keep your room cool
4. wearing socks
5. a gentle 15-minute yoga routine
6. placing your phone far away from your bed
7. aromatherapy (lavender, chamomile, or clary sage)
8. eating earlier to avoid stomach digestion or stimulation before bed

If you find the atmosphere in your room to be damaging to your sleep, there are tools you can use to block out the noise. Literally.

Try investing in blackout curtains, white noise machines (or listening to music with an auto-stop timer), and ear plugs, all of which you can buy online.

On the other hand, sleep hygiene, or clean sleep, is real and effective.

Before you truly take on the military method or 4-7-8 breathing, see what you can optimize to your bedroom for soundless slumber.

Medically reviewed by Deborah Weatherspoon, Ph.D., R.N., CRNA

— Written by Christal Yuen

Source:

• Ascher LM, et al. (1979). Paradoxical intention and insomnia: An experimental investigation. DOI:
  10.1016/0005-7967(79)90015-9
• Broomfield NM, et al. (2003). Initial insomnia and paradoxical intention: An experimental investigation of putative mechanisms using subjective and actigraphic measurement of sleep. DOI:
  10.1017/S1352465803003060
• Harvey AG, et al. (2002). The management of unwanted pre-sleep thoughts in insomnia: Distraction with imagery versus general distraction. DOI:
  10.1016/S0005-7967(01)00012-2
• Paradoxical intention for insomnia. (n.d.).
  div12.org/treatment/paradoxical-intention-for-insomnia/
• Progressive muscle relaxation script. (n.d.).
  law.berkeley.edu/files/Progressive_Muscle_Relaxation.pdf
• Trahan T, et al. (2018). The music that helps people sleep and the reasons they believe it works: A mixed methods analysis of online survey reports. DOI:
  10.1371/journal.pone.0206531

HI Kallie

Hope your treatment with immunotherapy is going well and not as brutal as chemo. Yes Im with you on the label incurable rather than terminal. At the end of the day life is terminal for everyone even if they have no illness. Ive not met anyone who has been told their cancer is terminal. Is this an American thing? Im around 6 months into immunotherapy and making the most of life dong the things I can do and accepting the things I cant do and dealing with cancer and treatment side effects as best I can. 

Ed

HI Jolamine

Thanks for your replies on insomnia. There is a huge amount of ideas to work through there and Ill sift through them to find if one will work for me. I hope life is going OK for you and see that you are very active here supporting members. Well done as it does take up valuable energy and time to do so. A pity more of the hundreds of those who read posts here do not contribute anything at all. So if you are one of those reading this how about making a resolution to one post once a week helping someone out with advice on an aspect of cancer you have some experience of. 

Ed