Hospice expectations/ experiences and guilt

My husband has advanced pancreatic cancer and is in the last few days/ weeks of his life. I have looked after him at home with support from the palliative team - phone to adjust meds and weekly visit from distict nurse.

It has been really hard - small house with a hospital bed downstairs and he has got gradually more dependent on me for moving, toileting etc and I give him his multitude of meds. He sleeps pretty much all the time with short periods of lucidness and convos.

We had talked about hsopice for the end but it felt like it was about getting the timing right. On friday he decided it was too much for me and my son and he was transferred to the hospice. I followed after and arrived in his room at the same time as his doctor. She went through the meds with me and spoke to him about what happens when you die - ie breathing stops etc. Then she went saying she was going to talk to the other docs and I didnt see her again. I stayed for  3 hours during which time a nurse came once and swabbed for covid.

And that was it.

When I left I found a nurse who then asked if I wanted to be notified in the night if there were changes.

And that was it.

On the way home I was very upset as its a big change and I know my husband will never see his home again. I also thought about the room he was in which was a hopsital style bay with spaces for 3 beds (only one in there though). There was a curtian that had come down draped over a table and a chair with a notice written on it saying broken, - no plants, colour, pictures or any homely touches. By the time I got home I had extreme guilt and feelings of abandonment and was in pieces. I phoned the reception when I got home, told her how I felt and asked if that was what all the rooms were like. She said it was attached to a hospital , but there were smaller rooms -she could swap another patient with him for  a smaller room. I didn't want that - it wouldnt be fair on the other patient.

Yesterday when I visited the broken chair had been moved, the curtain put back up and  a bunch of flowers put in a vase. so that was something. They had asked my husband if he wanted a smaller room and he said (typical of him) that he was okay.

During my stay, a nurse popped in for the meal order and my husband said he couldnt move up the bed and she said she would send some nurses to do it. They didnt come until eventually we pressed the button about half an hour later when he had been for a wee with my help. We mentioned he had pain and the nurse got oramorph and I mentioned paracateamol but he said it wasnt prescribed. He cam back half an later with some and then said actuallly it was presccribed! Should he not have known? I asked later if there was a doctor who i could talk to and the nurse said they would find out if they had left or not, but didn't come back until the driver needed changing - which I had pointed out to him. So, I got home again and cried buckets again. 

So...

I thought a hospice would provide a home from home - comfortable room with a warm homely feeling, not a hospital bay with the swish round yur cubicle blue curtains.

I thought there would be some kind of meet and greet oreinatation. Intro to hospice and how visiting times work - where can can't go, what available or a leaflet etc. I have read the website, but that was me at home.

I thought someone would assess his needs and current state and feed back to us about time left and meds changes etc

I thought someone would want to talk to me as the wife/ carer about how we are doing - our emotional needs. I have a teenage son who may need support too. Or signpost us to support.

I thought someone would give us a point of contact - a person who he is under that we refer to - we have the ward card and phone number, but no named person.

I thought someone would talk to us about what the next few days may hold and what will happen if.

Are my expectations too high - have I been naive about what a hospice is like and what happens? What questions should I ask and to whom? Do you book a time slot to talk to someone? Is it different at weekends? 

What are other people's experiences and dies anyone have any really good advice? At the moment it just doesn't feel right, I have terrific guilt and cry all the time.

Thank you.

  • I am so sorry to hear of your experience.  My dad was diagnosed in January with mesothelioma in January and. I was advised that they didn't expect him to to make it any further than the end of February but to my delight he has proved them all wrong!  Unfortunately  we have struggled to get any support at home from anyone.  The district nurse has only been twice, both times without any appointment so he was in bed asleep.  Palliative care contacted us once by phone at the beginning and said she would put some stuff in the post to us which was never received.  After I complained to his doctor we had another nurse ring and said she would come round that afternoon.  I said I wasn't sure if dad had a water infection and she said she would check that when she was there.  I got dad to wait going for a wee as she was due to turn up.  She was 1 1/2 late so poor dad was busting by the time she eventually turned up.  I said he had been waiting to go and she said "oh I won't be able to check his urine"!  She said she would email some Information over again nothing received.  After another complaint they sent another one who was slightly more helpful.  I had a phone call last week but in 4 months we have had a district nurse turn up twice and seen the palliative nurse twice!  He was more or less told that he won't be able to go into the hospice as there is a waiting list!  If someone is at the end of their life how the hell can they have a waiting list so unfortunately our palliative care is not a lot better and because the palliative care is so awful I wouldn't want dad going into their hospice because at least I have control as to how he is looked after at home 

     

  • Oh, Bev, I am so sorry to hear this. It sounds dreadful and wrong. I feel for you. Keep phoning and asking for help. I did phone the pancaretic uk helpline for support at one point they were good. And we have hopsital at home number who were reassuring overnight.

    It is emotionally and physically exhausting. At least 3 times I have expected him to die - possibly because I don't know what a rreson who is close to death looks like - that's why I asked for a professional to come and see him at least once a week. They were only going to phone  -covid or workload I dont know. 

    It took 2 weeks from being discharged from hospital and transferred to the pallaitive team for end of life before someone cam to assess him and talk about wishes etc. This shocked me as he hadn't talked to anyone about how he felt about this or what happend next. Again that may be my expectations and that is the usual waiting time. I guess when you have your loved one at end of life and very short time to go you expect things to kick in really quickly.

    Caring for someone who is dying is new to most of us and sometimes I think the professionals forget that. We don't know the process and procedures or what happens or what to do next or who to phone. I had to cry a lot down the phone (not forced as I am close to tears 24/7) before the palliative team suddenly realised that I was scared and although fairly intelligent didn.t know what was going to happen. They have been great since then and kept in close contact and supported me as much as my husband.

    The time was right for us as a family to look at hospice, because the alternative is nurses coming into the home or sitting overnight and this wouldnt work for us. I am guesssing this from what people have said, so you may well end up with lots of nurse help as your poor dad deteriorates.Plus I was/ am scared of him dying at home and not kowing what to do or not coping and being alone. And I have my son to think about. 

    But now I feel back in limbo and slightly abandoned again. And I don't know if he will be alone when he dies in the hospice - does someone sit with him if I am not there in time?

    Bev, I hope you get increasingly better support soon and that your dad's final weeks are peaceful and you are both well looked after. He is obviously well loved by you and you are doing a fanatstic job, but do look after yourself and your needs too. Keep phoning and asking for the help you need. 

  • This is heartbreaking to read and I am so sorry you are going through this. I am at the same point with my Mum who is 88 and has advanced pancreatic cancer and is being cared for by me at home (on my own) with sporadic visits from District Nurses and GPs. She won't have anyone visit from the hospice as she is convinced they are coming to take her away and she wants to die at home.

    It's very difficult as I need the support the palliative nurses could provide now (and would be providing if she was at the hospice) but she feels we are coping just fine. I'm dreading what's coming and when it gets worse, and I know I can escalate things and maybe get her to the hospice in the very last days but given how bad coordination and communication from the 'integrated palliative care team/hospice at home' things have been so far and the time it takes to get things in place I'm convinced that if I did seek a referral to the hospice it would be too late, there would be no capacity and things just wouldn't happen for us so we'd be left coping at home. None of us are trained for this and I think you've done the right thing getting your husband the professional expertise he needs now.

    Your questions are excellent.......and I would put all of these in writing to the most senior member of clinical staff at the hospice.

    Please take care and try not to beat yourself up over these decisions. You have done the right thing and you are still a very important part of the team supporting your husband so they need to factor you in and include you in decisions and the day to day care so that you don't feel abandoned. 

  • I feel for you HotPot and hope that you get all the support you need. You could speak to the palliative team and at least say you would like the option of a hospice and that is what you will consider if things get too bad at home. It may be that they need the okay from your mum to go there as they ask for their wishes.

    I didn't realise with our hospice that you can't book in adavnce but when you are ready you phone and if they have a bed they will take them in. I know the district nurse had contacted them earlier in the week, so maybe that's why we got in. She was good.

    I went in saturday- nobody to speak to. Asked if there were someone and the nurse said she would look and see if they had gone home - didn't return.

    Sunday I asked again and a lovely doctor came and we had a chat. She filled me in and answered questions, but said they didnt have enough people in at weekends and sort of apologised .She said the team are more consistent during the week. So, don't go in on a fri afternoon like we did maybe!

    Felt a bit reassured. 

    Monday - asked about a smaller room and he was moved immediately.- still very clinical but less like a hospital ward. 

    Today - asked nursing assisistnt who aid she would get the nurse to come after her break. Hour half later not appeared so long break or

    The nurses are lovely and very kind and helpful and super caring. But I have this feeling that even by the time he dies they will not know us as family anymore than when we came in, or our names on first term basis or how we are feeling or have  any worries. We (my son and I) just go in, visist and leave and a nurse will pop in if the buzzer is pressed or change the driver, but there is no scheduled meeting or even one point of contact. If you ask they will tell you ie "he's very sleepy", but not forthcoming otherwise, so I don't feel part of decision making. Its all very weird.

    Maybe I am doing something wrong? Maybe COVID has changed the way things work.

    The medical care and kindness is great and he now has a driver and catheter which I couldn't cope with at home, and he can't move without help so he is getting the best care he can. The catheter was in when we arrived on Sunday, but no discussion about it- I noticed it and asked. So it is better in that way, but sadly he has deteriorated and sleeps and says few words when we go. Its actually even more sad now, but his medical needs are met.

    HotPot thank you for your kind words. Things are still horrible, but at least I have stopped being scared and panicking - still exhausted and think that's the emotional side as well as physical.

    I hope things work out for you and your mum and you get the best care possible for both of you. My heart goes out to you - I know what it feels like. Best wishes.